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I just finished Sean Carroll's Something Deeply Hidden, and found it the best explanation of MWI I've ever seen, and even find that I have no good arguments against it; the parts I understand seem plausible (there are certainly parts I don't understand). One point I find problematic, however, is his p170-1 suggestion that we can see "world splitting" as either "globally instantaneous" or as propagating through space at the speed of light, since either gives the same predictions. This is unsatisfying since, given relativity, there is simply no such thing as globally simultaneity. So it must be the former, but it was not explained how this works with non-local correlation. I have an idea about this and want to hear back from MWI-supporters to tell me if I'm on the right track, or how to better think about this.

Say Alice is near Earth measuring a particle whose spin is correlated with one measured by Bob near Jupiter. According to MWI each measurement splits the world into one where they measure it spin up, another spin down. But as these measurements must be correlated, there are not four possibilities, only two. This leads me to the following picture: that as they speed toward each other or share signals about their results, the two copies of each (Alice-up, Alice-down, Bob-up, Bob-down) are in a sense separated from each other in Hilbert space so that they only "see" or meet the other which has "moved" to the same part of Hilbert space, so Alice-up meets or gets a message from Bob-up, Alice-down meets Bob-down. Each of the new up-up/down-down pairs has, in a sense, made the same shift to a different part of Hilbert space--and when they or their signals meet in physical space, can interact--but Alice-up is radically shifted away from Bob-down and so cannot interact with him. Or, to put it another way, the particle measurements made by Alice and Bob each split the world, but this split can only interact with things within its light cone, and when its effects interact in physical space they only do so with things in the right location in Hilbert space. Or, to put it a third (?) way, the split propagates at the speed of light, but these two splitting-waves are correlated in such a way that, whenever or wherever the Alice-split-wave meets the Bob-split-wave, the two up-split waves neatly meet and merge, same with the two down-waves, each merging occurring, but each merging now becoming just a single split (in the future light cone of the merge). But maybe this is again just a restatement of my first point, if the "propagating split" is simply the propagation of particles and signals which can interact, but occurring in one or another part of Hilbert space.

I'm also trying to picture this with a kind of altitude analogy, seeing height as a kind of dimension in Hilbert space separate from (and much bigger than) physical space, or rather defining many different versions or levels of otherwise similar "physical" spaces. It's as if Alice and Bob, initially at 20K feet, are hurtling toward each other from, say, east and west, but Alice & Bob "up" have both been shifted to 30K feet and so see each other as they pass; Alice & Bob "down" have been shifted to 10K feet, and see each other, but neither pair approaches the other pair, even though looking from straight down it looks like their planar geographical coordinates are the same. So all four can head to, say, "Mars," but the Mars-up that A-up and B-up meet at is not the same Mars that A-down and B-down meet at, though they otherwise look a lot alike.

My summary question: do these various different ways of explaining it (or various different ways of stating a single explanation?) make sense in terms of the MWI? Are some better than others? If any are close to right, I'm tempted to say that MWI actually explains the "before-before" and other correlation experiments better than anything else I've read, and discards "action at a distance" because while all four measurement results occur, none caused each other, and the observed correlation between the particles is manifested by the fact that each observer can only interact with the post-measurement version of her partner which saw the same result.

I'm not a professional physicist, just an interested outsider and eager to attain greater clarity on this, or correction if what I'm saying is incorrect or misleading. To that end, please don't answer merely with criticisms of MWI unless they relate directly to my question, as I'm most interested in first understanding MWI properly.

Qmechanic
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  • The Hilbert space has a clear notion of simultaneity (there is a definite global time parameterization either in the QM state or in the operators, depending on the picture) so it is difficult to implement a relativistic reasoning there. Also, nothing 'splits' within the Hilbert space itself (systems just diffuse there, possibly into vastly separated sectors if we keep the evolution unitary, which is the point of MWI), so from this point of view (and after all, that's where the math lives) I believe you will not find any difference between MWI and some other QM interpretation. – Stéphane Rollandin Feb 07 '20 at 08:28
  • Thank you. 1) I did not realize that Hilbert space reintroduced absolute simultaneity. This was not mentioned in Carroll's book; is there by any chance a resource you could direct me to which explains & elaborates on this in as elementary fashion as possible? 2) I do not understand your distinction between "splitting" and "diffusing...into vastly separated sectors." Carroll explained that "splitting" is itself somewhat metaphorical and I thought it was intended to mean something like what your second phrase means; if you see a further distinction, please spell this out further if possible. – Scott Forschler Feb 07 '20 at 14:44
  • The link doesn't seem helpful; only point 4 of the question therein seems even partly relevant to my question, while the long answer begins by announcing that the formalism/mathematics will be discussed, not interpretations thereof. This is confirmed toward the end when Javier speaks only of how the mathematically-defined state of a system in Hilbert states results in probabilities of various observations, but without resolving the question of whether this is a wave function "collapse" or "world splitting." – Scott Forschler Feb 08 '20 at 19:03
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    I'm fearing that you just may not be addressing the question or quite even seeing what I'm asking. When you say there is no "difference" to be found amongst several interpretations, that really makes no sense unless you're talking just about the mathematics of what we observe. Which is true, but that's not what I'm asking about. Saying you use the same math either way doesn't resolve the question of whether the wave function collapses or remains whole but observers/systems in some sense split (or "separate into sectors"). – Scott Forschler Feb 08 '20 at 19:08
  • Yes, I did not intend the link to answer your question, but to present to you a detailed account of what the Hilbert space is, which notably emphasizes that it is related to phase space (although it is not phase space), while your reasoning seems to liken it to spacetime. I'm afraid I cannot do much more from the comment section here, but anyway I am not a proponent of MWI and I guess we just have to wait and see if one of them comes up and answers your question. – Stéphane Rollandin Feb 08 '20 at 19:08
  • As for the 'no difference since it is the same math', yes, you are right, but precisely the question of collapse-or-not is not something you can see from the Hilbert space. Is is related to how we are to use and make sense of the whole Hilbert space representation business, in a broader interpretational context. – Stéphane Rollandin Feb 08 '20 at 19:12
  • Well, I was only "likening" phase space to spacetime as a kind of graphical analogy, much as a standard Minkowski space-time diagram "likens" time to an axis on a 2d graph, which is surely unobjectionable if we don't make the error of supposing that time is space, or that all Hilbert phase changes are spatial. Your comment puzzles me further when you say Javier says Hilbert space is like, but is not quite, phase space; what is the difference? I keyword-searched the linked answer for references to "phase" and see no sentences which make this distinction. – Scott Forschler Feb 08 '20 at 19:29
  • Actually I now suspect that your comment about QM simultaneity may simply be referring to the fact that the Schrodinger equation as currently used does not have a relativistic form. Which again is not to the point, for ultimately we must find some way to integrate QM and relativity. So QM as such does not rule out relativity, it simply does not incorporate it as understood so far. Which again would make my suggestion above interesting if it is correct, for it would show the compatibility between these two. – Scott Forschler Feb 08 '20 at 21:32
  • It sounds like you are thinking about it in the right way. You may want to check out David Wallace's book (The Emergent Multiverse) which has a section dedicated to the relativistic question. p307 "branching is not a global phenomenon. Rather when some microscopic superposition is magnified up to macroscopic scales, it leads to a branching event to propagate outwards at the speed of whatever dynamical interaction is causing decoherence" – isometry Jun 04 '20 at 22:31
  • Thanks Bruce, I did read Wallace's book, but I only have math through intro to multivariate calculus, and his equation-laden text mostly went over my head. However I may look at it again after having read Carroll's more narrative text, and see it makes more sense this time. – Scott Forschler Jun 05 '20 at 23:32

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