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Following from this question, I am now confused how clocks of one observer is turning into disagreement with that of another. I have seen a mathematical explanation here, but what is the physical explanation of how one clock starts ticking slower than another?

Relevant to answering this maybe the Andromeda paradox.

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    What do you mean by "physical explanation"? As the second question you link says, the "desync" is due to how different observers in different frames perceive time/simultaneity, not due to anything "physical" acting on the clocks itself. – ACuriousMind Nov 22 '22 at 09:36
  • If you say it desyncs due to how different observers perceive time then it seems like assuming the explanation is circular. We can only say it desync once we observe it different. I don't understand how you concluded it's nto because of anything physical happening to the clocks @ACuriousMind – tryst with freedom Nov 22 '22 at 09:39
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    Have a read through How can time dilation be symmetric?. Although this is a different question is does explain the key fact you need to understand. The two observers do not agree on what the time axis is i.e. what one observer sees as a displacement in time looks like a displacement in both time and space to the other observer. The two clocks get out of sync because they are not measuring the same thing. – John Rennie Nov 22 '22 at 09:45
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    @TrystwithFreedom If a distant external observer could, just by his state of motion, cause something physical to happen to another frame's clock, that would present a real problem for time keeping. – JEB Nov 22 '22 at 15:13
  • One clock could just have a slower crystal oscillator, on the low end of the tolerance range. But of course, that's not really what you're asking. – Hearth Nov 23 '22 at 05:04
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    It's not that the clock tick slower. It's just that time is flowing at different rates for the two clocks. The clocks themselves can measure time perfectly at the same rate but will still desync because each is measuring it's own version of "time". The constant in the universe is not time, time varies depending on observer. The constant in the universe is the speed of light in a vacuum. We know that the speed of light is constant because of multiple experiments confirming it as such. – slebetman Nov 23 '22 at 07:10
  • If you think more about what you would consider to be "a physical explanation" then it might help unravel the problem for you. We could imagine some force on crystals that slows their oscillation or changes their resonant frequency, but of course you already know there is no such force in the model. The physical explanation is, "when compared, more time has passed for clock A than for clock B". You can unpack how we compare it too, but relativity is describing (among other things) how much time passes. A model of physics is the physical explanation, it just might not be easy to understand. – Steve Jessop Nov 23 '22 at 15:00
  • As several answers indicate, what "physically happens" is that the two clocks move in different directions in 4 dimensional spacetime. – Eric Smith Nov 23 '22 at 16:42
  • Consider the Einstein light clock thought experiment (PBS Space Time visualization), where constant speed of light means it has to travel greater distances in a moving clock. – Roman Odaisky Nov 23 '22 at 16:59
  • I quite like to know how the clocks got out of sync on a spiritual level. ;) – stackoverblown Nov 23 '22 at 17:26
  • @stackoverblown: and for that matter a general-relativistic explanation of how spirit levels work. – Steve Jessop Nov 24 '22 at 10:12
  • Relevant article: Project GREAT. – JBH Nov 25 '22 at 07:31

8 Answers8

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The easiest way to understand time dilation and length contraction is to examine the same effects in ordinary Euclidean geometry. The analogy is not exact, but it gives the intuition a starting point that can be adjusted with the mathematical details.

Consider two people walking at the same speed but in slightly different directions across a field. Each of them defines their own coordinate system consisting of 'forwards' and 'sideways' directions. Because they are moving forwards at a constant rate, this stands in as a proxy for time. 'Sideways' then stands in for the spatial dimensions.

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We look at the forwards-sideways coordinate system of the walker on the right. He lays a ruler sideways to measure space, and counts steps forwards to measure ticks of time. He glances at his companion to the left. His companion has his own ruler, laid out 'sideways', but his 'sideways' is tilted! The result is that the distance between the ends of his neighbour's ruler according to his own coordinate system is shorter than it should be. Likewise, his companion has fallen slightly behind. He appears to be moving more slowly across the field, the 'ticks' of his footsteps are closer together than they should be.

The walker on the left, looking at his companion on the right, says exactly the same things. The ends of his friend's ruler are too close together in the 'sideways' direction. He is moving 'forwards' at a slower rate. They can both see the other as shrunk in space and falling backward in time because they are each using different definitions for sideways/forwards corresponding to space/time.

The moving clock does not 'tick slower' - it is because its ticks are being measured along a different direction in spacetime. The ticks themselves haven't changed - what has changed is our choice of definitions of time and space.

The two different meanings of time in special relativity correspond to the two different meanings of 'distance' in Euclidean geometry. Say we move along some curvy winding path to the point 3 miles east and 4 miles north of where we started. How far have we walked? Well, if we just look at the distance north we have travelled, this is 4 miles. This is like the coordinate time. We have to specify a particular coordinate system, and every point has a well-defined distance from the starting point. But if we switch to a different coordinate system (magnetic north instead of true north, say) then the answer will change. The other way to look at it is the length of the curvy path we actually walked along. This corresponds to the proper time, and is the time a moving observer will experience, and is the time shown by a clock he carries with him (counting steps). The 'proper time' length for a path is the same in any coordinate system. It doesn't matter if you use magnetic north or true north or north-east and south-west as your coordinate directions - if you walked 7 miles in one coordinate system, it's 7 miles in all of them. However, there is no longer a well-defined 'distance' between points - it depends what route you took. So I might have walked 7 miles, but my twin brother walked a different route and has travelled 8 miles, although we both ended up at exactly the same place.

Coordinate time is a property of places, proper time is a property of paths.

So the reason clocks physically get out of sync is that they are measuring the along-the-curve length of the path through spacetime, and people following different routes through spacetime will travel different distances. Clocks don't measure coordinate time (unless they move in a straight line along the coordinate axis), they measure proper time.

The analogy works quite well for a lot of purposes, but there is a big difference between Euclidean geometry and Minkowski geometry, which boils down to the form of Pythagoras's Theorem. In Euclidean space, the squared length of the hypotenuse of a right-angled triangle is the sum of the squared lengths of the sides. In 3D, this looks like $h^2=x^2+y^2+z^2$. We can rotate our $xyz$ coordinates any way we like, the length remains the same. When we add a time coordinate (coordinate time, not proper time), the sign flips. So we can define a length $h^2=t^2-x^2-y^2-z^2$ which is the proper time along the straight path between two points, or we can take the other convention and define $h^2=-t^2+x^2+y^2+z^2$ which is the proper length as measured by a ruler in relativity. Either way, the length remains the same in any orthonormal coordinate system. Apart from this sign-flip, time dilation and length contraction in Minkowski space are exactly analogous to the mixing of forwards/sideways directions in Euclidean space described above. They work the same way.

Thus, clocks getting out of sync is physically no stranger than people taking different routes to the same place walking different distances along the way. The time you experience is measured along the path you follow.

  • straight-line distance should be 5 miles, not 4 – user253751 Nov 23 '22 at 16:14
  • I suspect the OP is confused about how the clocks, brought back together, have a different reading. Having the two people walking in the field have a pedometer (the clock), and have one of them change direction and "catch up" to the other, and you'll see that the pedometer of the one who changed direction reads as "more time passed" (aka, distance). – Yakk Nov 24 '22 at 20:25
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You are asking for a physical explanation of the relativity of simultaneity, but the simple fact is that simultaneity itself is not physical. Simultaneity is a matter of arbitrary convention, not a matter of physical fact. It is determined by humans, not by nature. Nature cares about causality, only humans care about simultaneity.

The most famous simultaneity convention is Einstein’s. He proposed adopting a simultaneity convention defined by setting the one way speed of light equal to $c$. When Einstein’s convention is applied to two different inertial reference frames it is determined that they disagree.

He explicitly identified his synchronization convention as a matter of definition. Later, Hans Reichenbach showed that other arbitrary synchronization conventions are also possible and that no physical experiment could choose between them. Reichenbach’s convention was further refined by Anderson.

Because the choice of synchronization convention is a matter of choice there simply is no valid answer to your question of how do they physically get out of sync. Getting out of sync is not physical.

Dale
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  • How do you know simultaneity is not physical? – tryst with freedom Nov 22 '22 at 15:16
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    This answer, in particular your last sentence, is just wrong. Clocks getting out of sync is absolutely physical and has been proven many time in experiment and GPS satellites prove it every second of every day. GPS clocks physically run at a different rate than clocks on earth. It doesn't matter if it's a wind up alarm clock or a clock that runs on the vibration of atoms, they both physically run at different rates. – foolishmuse Nov 22 '22 at 16:26
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    @foolishmuse I think Dale means that there is nothing physical about a single clock getting out of sync (with some external reference clock). Certainly a pair of clocks may get out of sync, but for example one couldn't stare at a clock and watch it going in and out of sync due to some physical influence on the clock mechanism itself. – J. Murray Nov 22 '22 at 16:49
  • @J.Murray Perhaps you are correct, but the OP uses " how clocks of one observer is turning into disagreement with that of another" which implies two clocks. – foolishmuse Nov 22 '22 at 16:50
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    @TrystwithFreedom asked “How do you know simultaneity is not physical?” Because no physical experiment depends on whether or not two events are simultaneous – Dale Nov 22 '22 at 17:17
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    @foolishmuse it seems like you are talking about different clocks having different time dilation (physically, different proper time), but I am talking about the relativity of simultaneity. I believe that the question is about the relativity of simultaneity rather than time dilation – Dale Nov 22 '22 at 17:22
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    @Dale Obviously there are physical experiments demonstrating clocks getting out of sync (I think they did quite a few with airplanes carrying atomic clocks). Time dilation is indeed physical and the explanation for it is that neither time nor space themselves are sufficient to describe "positions", i.e. we need time AND space and their invariant square. Getting out of sync is basically totally physical but a result of an incomplete observation and not an inherent property of time. – famfop Nov 23 '22 at 10:52
  • @famfop it seems that you, like foolish muse, are talking about time dilation. I am talking about the relativity of simultaneity, which is the topic of the question, by my understanding. – Dale Nov 23 '22 at 13:53
  • @Dale "no physical experiment depends on whether or not two events are simultaneous" strikes me as an odd statement (even though I have no doubt that what you write is correct). What about the experiment of dropping, simultaneously, a lead ball and a feather in vacuum, and measuring whether or not they hit the ground simultaneously? – Marc Vaisband Nov 23 '22 at 15:02
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    @MarcVaisband suppose that your experiment were designed to produce a 1 if they hit the ground simultaneously and a 0 if they did not. Then someone else (using the same laws of physics to analyze the experiment, but moving wrt you) would find that your experiment registers a 1 not when they land simultaneously but when their landings are offset by a specific amount. – Dale Nov 23 '22 at 18:50
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Your question assumes that two clocks are out of synch as a result of one ticking more slowly than the other. That is not correct. In SR all good clocks tick at the same rate.

The change in synchronisation between reference frames is a consequence of the 4-dimensional geometry of spacetime. If you and I are stationary relative to each other, your time axis and mine both point in the same direction. However, if we move relative to each other, your t axis and mine no longer point in the same direction, but become tilted relative to each other. A plane of constant time for you is one at right angles to your time axis, and a plane of constant time for me is one at right angles to my time axis. Since our time axes point in different directions, a plane of constant time in your frame is a sloping slice through time in my frame, and vice versa. That means that all along a plane of constant time in my frame, the time is increasingly ahead or behind in yours, ie increasingly out of synch with time in mine.

Marco Ocram
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I'm not sure what you'd consider a good answer to your question, but consider this question for a moment instead:

New Question: You and I buy identical new cars, with the odometers set to zero. I drive to the mall and back. You drive three times around the perimeter of the country and back. After we've both returned, we notice that our odometers show different numbers. How did they our odometers get out of synch?

If you are able to formulate an answer to the New Question that makes you happy, that's also the answer to your original question.

Edited to add: Both your original question and the New Question are special cases of this:

More General Question: Given two points in a metric space and two paths connecting those points, how can the two paths have different lengths?

In your original question, the metric space in question is spacetime, the first point is a traveler's departure from (say) earth, the second point is the traveler's return, and the two paths are the paths followed by the earth and the traveler. In the New Question, the metric space is the surface of the earth, the two points are both equal to the point where we begin and end our journeys, and the two paths are mine and yours. With that dictionary, you can translate any answer to the New Question into an answer to the original question (and vice versa).

WillO
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    I don't think the New Question points to that unless you already know the answer that the analogy is supposed to be about. Our odometers measure the integral of the velocity of the road relative to our cars, not our path length through 4-space, and both of us can approximate our time axis as having never changed direction. – g s Nov 22 '22 at 22:57
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    While I would agree that the New Question you propose is analogous, I think you could improve this by explaining exactly how it is analogous to the OP's question. – Sandejo Nov 23 '22 at 01:24
  • @Sandejo : See edit. – WillO Nov 23 '22 at 13:34
  • @gs : see edit. – WillO Nov 23 '22 at 13:34
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Time runs slower when you move at some speed. And time runs slower if you enter a field of gravity.

For the clocks on a GPS satellite, there is a strong effect of them being slower because the satellite is moving at high speed, and a weaker effect of them running faster because they are further away from earths gravity. (Strong = dozens of microseconds per day).

Yes, it is physical. Under certain conditions, time as observed from the outside of your system runs faster or slower, but it is time itself that changes, not your clock.

Inside your system you can't detect the effect because anything that might detect it is also slower. There is nothing that affects clocks specifically. Everything is affected in the exact same way, and your clock looks perfectly fine to you. If you were at 99% of the speed of light, where the effect would be clearly visible (unlike dozens of microseconds per day, which you personally can't observe), you won't notice it because you are slowed down exactly like the clock.

  • Inside your system you can't detect the effect because anything that might detect it is also slower this is pivotal. – Grimm The Opiner Nov 24 '22 at 15:32
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    In your own fame, it's meaningless to say that "your brain is slowed down exactly like your clock, so you don't notice it", because it implies an absolute notion of "slow" clocks. – Ryder Rude Nov 25 '22 at 01:52
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This is a fundamental law. You can't really ask a "mechanical explanation" of this because this law defines the mechanics. There are no gears working behind this.

The deepest explanation you can get for this is the "geometry of spacetime" : The Minkowski metric defines an invariant distance for events on spacetime.

In the rest frame of a clock, the events of different ticks of the clock take place at the same place in space. The Minkowski distance between two ticks is (because $x_2=x_1$):

$$(t_2-t_1) ^2- (x_2-x_1) ^2= (t_2-t_1) ^2$$

In a frame where the clock is moving, the same ticks happen at two different point in space, i. e. $(x'_2-x'_1)$ is non-zero. The Minkowski distance is:

$$(t_2'-t_1') ^2- (x'_2-x_1') ^2$$

The two Minkowski distances must be equal. So: $$(t_2'-t'_1) ^2- (x'_2-x'_1) ^2=(t_2-t_1) ^2$$

From this, it follows that $(t_2'-t_1') >(t_2-t_1) $

Ryder Rude
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I actually disagree with the comparatively universal contention in the answers so far that there isn't a "mechanical" or "physical" explanation for the slowing of a moving clock. Because there will be such an explanation depending on the precise mechanism of the clock. The actually surprising thing is that the dilatation ends up the same regardless of what actual mechanism the clock employs internally.

The simplest clock for looking at dilatation is a light clock that measures the time light takes to travel to a mirror in a fixed distance and back again. The equivalence of reference frames requires that the light in all reference frames travels at the same speed, but when a light clock moves sideways, the light has to travel at a zigzag path rather than straight back and forth and consequently takes a longer time when viewed from a non-moving frame.

Essentially all clocks work using some periodic process like the back-and-forth of light traveling to a mirror, and all periodic physical processes are delayed by the same amount when looking from outside of a moving frame, even if the "light clock" thought experiment, being tied into light propagation directly, is perhaps the easiest for working out the relations.

Though other properties that can determine oscillator frequencies, like length, electrical and magnetic fields, masses, and so on, all behave under movement in a manner that does not allow determining one physically preferred frame of reference.

So the whole ensemble of physical properties behaves in a uniform manner that can be represented by transforming the notion of time as the duration of repetitive mechanical processes in the same manner.

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The answer is given previously are correct, but I don't think they explain what you are looking for. The answer is that one clock literally does tick slower than the other. So imagine that you are standing on the Earth with a clock next to you, ticking away. Another clock is on a rocket ship that is circling the earth right past you, at a very high speed, what we would call a relativistic speed. You would clearly see that time is passing slower, or that the clock on the rocket is ticking slower than your clock. If one minute passed on your clock, on the rocket clock perhaps only 59 seconds has passed as it passes by you. And each time that the rocket passed by the difference between your clocks would be greater and greater. So yes it is a physical actual slowing of time and thus a slowing of the ticking of the clock on the relativistic rocket. That is the physical meaning of special relativity. And keep in mind that it is not just a clock that changes but time itself, so the beating of the heart of the astronaut in the rocket and the aging of his cells all occur at the slowing rate

foolishmuse
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  • But eben you aren't getting me. I am asking how does the clock tick slower? For what type of mechanical explanation can be given for it? – tryst with freedom Nov 22 '22 at 15:32
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    The plain answer to your question is that nobody knows. It comes down to the warping of spacetime, but nobody knows exactly how this occurs. People will talk about spacetime manifolds and other such things, but this does not provide a physical answer that you are seeking. I have come up with my own, highly speculative theory that you can find here: https://vixra.org/abs/2202.0156 that might get you thinking, but don't quote it in any paper you are writing. – foolishmuse Nov 22 '22 at 16:30
  • I was with you right up to here: "So yes it is a physical actual slowing of time and thus a slowing of the ticking of the clock on the relativistic rocket." All you've said up to this point is that the clock on the rocket ticks slowly. Then we have "So yes it is a physical actual slowing of time" which seems to be a) unclear as to what it means, b) a non sequitur even if the meaning is clarified, and c) even if meaningful and correct, occurs here only as part of a circular argument: "The clock ticks slowly, therefore time slows, therefore the clock ticks slowly". – WillO Nov 22 '22 at 19:16
  • @WillO. I'm sorry. Time passes more slowly and therefore anything that takes time passes more slowly whether that be the ticking of a clock the beating of a heart or the vibration of an atom. – foolishmuse Nov 22 '22 at 19:19
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    I beg your pardon, Earthling. I turned off my rocket to make sure that we were both in approximately isometric inertial frames and measured our clocks, and it was your clock that ticks more slowly. I have the measurements of your relativistic-velocity planet right here on my perfectly stationary rocket that prove it. – g s Nov 22 '22 at 22:36
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    @gs There is a simple answer to this. Two clocks leave point A simultaneously and move through different paths to arrive at point B simultaneously. The clock that moves the longer distance on its path between A and B will have ticked less. You can forget all that twin paradox stuff. – foolishmuse Nov 22 '22 at 23:30
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    My rocket has always been right here, it's your planet which has been traveling for a longer distance. Get in your rocket, boost into a new frame, and fly over here to my perfectly stationary rocket, and you'll find that it was indeed your clock ticking more slowly all along. – g s Nov 23 '22 at 00:06